Question 3

Peebles Corp. CEO Don Peebles
Development | New York/Miami | Male | 35 YEARS OF EXPERIENCE 

To address a problem we must be willing to acknowledge it exists.

Two steps forward and one and a half steps backward. People of color represent less than 1% of all CRE executives, yet the industry believes success within it is merit-based. Obviously, today it’s not, but to address a problem we must be willing to acknowledge it exists.

Asset Management | Chicago | Female | 15 YEARS OF EXPERIENCE 

The talk about improving diversity is just that — all talk. 

It hasn't changed much, but I recognize that change is hard. I've never experienced outward racism or disrespect while working in the real estate industry, which I've absolutely experienced and heard others experience in investment banking, hedge fund shops, etc. But the talk about improving diversity is just that — all talk. I think it would help if the real estate industry focused on developing relationships with historically black colleges and universities, programs like Sponsors for Educational Opportunity and Toigo. A few shops have moved in that direction, but again, just a few.

Affordable Housing Brokerage | Fort Lauderdale | Male | 23 YEARS OF EXPERIENCE 

I would love to see more minorities in ownership. 

In my niche, there are a number of minorities in the banking and governmental side of the business, none on the brokerage side of the business. I would love to see more minorities in ownership in the affordable housing arena. In my 23 years in commercial brokerage, working for three of the nation’s largest firms, I've seen few black agents and no managers of color. Without managers and decision-makers in leadership roles, reaching our potential will be difficult if not impossible.

Finance | Charlotte | Female | 16 YEARS OF EXPERIENCE 

I’m no longer asked to sit in the back and remain quiet during client meetings.  

There is certainly more diversity in the industry than there was when I first started. Attitudes have softened — I’m no longer asked to sit in the back and remain quiet during client meetings. But, black CRE professionals remain almost nonexistent in executive positions. They are not well-represented at industry events (on panels, speaking engagements, etc.).

Chicago Trend founder and CEO Lyneir Richardson
Retail Brokerage/Development | Chicago | Male | 20 YEARS OF EXPERIENCE 

Companies are identifying emerging opportunities for people of color to lead a project. 

Within the last five years, there’s been more attention and discussion around inclusive real estate commercial developments. Systematically, companies are identifying emerging opportunities for people of color to lead a project. Ten to 15 years ago, it was about minority participation and they were set aside. They were the subcontractor of a deal. With time, it’s continuing to evolve. People of color are leading a project and controlling the resources, running the pro forma, managing the relationship with the commercial tenant. All that makes me optimistic.

Because the educational level and the execution and the expertise are there and now there is a track record of performance for funds and projects that are led by entrepreneurs of color, now I think over time we’ll be getting more opportunities and continue to excel. I am confident that if we continue to be excellent, and do the work with an urgent and patient mentality, we’re going to catch up and be OK.

CRE Consulting | Charlotte | Male | 10 YEARS OF EXPERIENCE 

The CRE industry has a long way to go.

I believe the CRE industry is starting to get in front of the diversity initiatives that have lagged the industry. More than often it’s been a generational problem and a lack of introduction to the industry for most minorities looking at the job market. The Real Estate Associate Program and supplier diversity organizations, along with other industry groups, have helped bring about change. However, the CRE industry has a long way to go. It’s imperative corporate America continues to advocate for diversity in CRE to see real progression.

Brokerage | Chicago | Male | 35 YEARS OF EXPERIENCE 

The resurfacing of over 50 years of racist sentiment suggests that things won’t change until people’s minds are changed. 

While there has been a greater acceptance of involvement in support roles, blacks remain significantly underrepresented in positions of power and responsibility over capital and assets (i.e. development, acquisitions, investment property sales, tenant representation, structured finance and especially in the ownership of firms that provide such services). The more lucrative the transaction or project, the more pronounced the disparity.

Companies that embrace diversity and inclusion are to be applauded but must move beyond equal opportunity to grasp the significance of differential equity. This is to suggest in a metaphorical race that all runners should not begin at the same starting block because some may be handicapped by systemic and structural inequities that require a different starting point for the race to be fair. The disappointing lack of diversity in race (and gender) in the CRE industry is unlikely to change as long as clients (owners, investors, tenants) tolerate the status quo and conduct business as usual. It may take the incentive of financial gain to meaningfully impact the presence and role of blacks in the CRE industry. There must be a perceived need to hire, develop and advance blacks in CRE as there was when Wall Street pivoted in the municipal bond business in the 1980s, hiring minorities in response to the slew of newly elected government officials of color.   

While financial incentives may motivate professional priorities, the resurfacing of over 50 years of racist sentiment in this country suggests that things won’t change until people’s minds are changed, and mind changes often require life events. In this regard, the growth in interracial marriages and resulting future generations may provide some hope for a society that will judge people “by the content of their character rather than the color of their skin.”

DREAM Collaborative co-founder Gregory Minott
Architecture | Boston | Male | 25 YEARS OF EXPERIENCE 

Now it is seen as a competitive advantage to embrace diversity. 

Outspoken leaders who championed the cause of people of color in the corporate world, such as Whitney Young, certainly paved the way for change. Decades later we are seeing a difference in CRE because now it is seen as a competitive advantage to embrace diversity. Public agencies are now taking a leadership role in equity, diversity and inclusion, making CRE more accessible through public-private partnerships.

There is still a lot of work to be done, making sure policies are aligned with results. Eventually, what needs to happen is a shift in business culture with racial inclusiveness becoming just the way business is done. We will have reached success when it’s no longer an anomaly to have, for example, black-owned developers, architects and brokerage houses that have the capacity of doing transformative projects at a significant scale.  

Multifamily Investment | Chicago | Female | 2 YEARS OF EXPERIENCE 

There are more people realizing their unconscious biases.

I believe there are more people realizing that their unconscious biases have been formed out of a lack of experience and/or a lack of interaction. However, I believe it is a two-way street — more blacks should feel that they belong at the table and work hard at getting there. I also believe that non-blacks should check their egos and realize that when there is no place we will make one regardless of being allowed. There is greater success when you have a variety of minds working to create new solutions. I believe that in every field, but especially in CRE, your success is a direct result of your hard work, perseverance and willingness to learn. Biases are an unnecessary additive to the equation and those individuals who have dominated the industry should allow work ethic and willingness to learn be the proof that a person deserves to be at the table.  

The Real Estate Associate Program Executive Director Ken McIntyre
Advocacy | New York City | Male | 30+ YEARS OF EXPERIENCE 

If your organization is not becoming more diverse, you need to take a hard look. 

In many places the industry's attitude toward race has softened over the years, but unfortunately in many places it hasn't. To put it simply, given the trends of demographics in this country, if your organization or firm has not become or is not becoming more diverse, you need to take a hard look because there must be something causing it to not follow the demographic trend.  

Investment | San Francisco | Male | 40 YEARS OF EXPERIENCE 

More minorities need to enter the industry. 

There are more minorities in CRE than before, but still few significant players. More minorities need to enter the industry and more entrepreneurs need to be funded and encouraged.

Retail Brokerage | Houston | Female | 7 YEARS OF EXPERIENCE 

We all need to do more to encourage and educate young people (of all races) about careers in CRE.  

I have been fortunate to work in Houston, a very diverse community, for my entire career. Mostly, I become highly aware of my fortune when traveling for work across the country, especially when attending ICSC where there are thousands of CRE professionals and I can still count all the black people on two hands. We all need to do more to encourage and educate young people (of all races) about careers in CRE and how they can get involved outside of being related to someone already in the industry.

Guesst founder and CEO Jay Norris
Retail/Tech | New York City | Male | 12 YEARS OF EXPERIENCE 

What needs to happen now is a future “CRE World” that embraces the creative, innovative deal-maker minds no matter their gender, creed or color.

The business has changed tremendously because the majority of deals’ access points have changed. We can access deals from technology and not [just] from traditional brokerages. It allows us to move off of one’s vision, knowledge and resources anywhere in the world. This has changed the CRE and the banking world to be clearly transparent to the ENTIRE world of business transactions in general.

What needs to happen now is a future “CRE World” that embraces the creative, innovative deal-maker minds no matter their gender, creed or color.

Multifamily Brokerage | Dallas-Fort Worth | Male | 8 YEARS OF EXPERIENCE 

The numbers remain low.  

There have been more people of color intrigued by CRE and seeking to participate in it for long-term careers as well as investing. There are very talented African-Americans making impacts in every arena, though unfortunately the numbers remain low in terms of participation, going from 1% to 1.3% in roughly a decade since I have been involved.

Continue to support organizations like the Real Estate Associate Program. Large corporations should consider qualified individuals who have a true path to growth by offering real working opportunities as opposed to menial roles to check a box.

Colliers International Executive Managing Director Eric Yarbro
Brokerage | New York City | Male | 32 YEARS OF EXPERIENCE 

Unless there is a government mandate, we’re going to be in the same place 20 years from now.

I’m a glass-half-full kind of person. When I got in the industry there were no true affinity groups. CBRE was one of the first companies to start an affinity group — The Women's Network — and then I founded the African-American Network. I was able to grow it from the original four founding members to 400 over a 10-year period. But if you look at the construction industry with $100B in projects that are going on in New York alone — there has not been as much of a level of diverse participation that I've seen in any real significant way.

Unless there is a government mandate that the money and the work disseminated for real estate projects must be more diverse, then we’re going to be in the same place 20 years from now. I like the fact that Gov. Andrew Cuomo has created a 30% minority procurement goal for projects that happen in New York. I see the Comptroller's office and the Mayor’s office being able to play a key role if they would. They recently released an Emerging Developers’ Program for minorities and women to source more emerging developers.

On the private side, corporations need to say: “If you want to handle my business, I want to see a woman and ethnic minorities on the team. And if you submit your RFP and you want to do our real estate business, unless there's somebody on the team that is coming with a diverse viewpoint, I will not award you this business.”

Unless that happens we're not going to see much change. Company leadership will ultimately choose who they want on their teams. I know a number of women who are heads of real estate for their respective companies, and still teams who pursue business walk in the door with the same four white guys to pitch the business and most times they win the business. If [diversity] is not mandated with strict penalties in the RFP process then nobody will take it as seriously, as they haven't for the last 30 years.

Investment Management | Chicago | Female | 30+ YEARS OF EXPERIENCE 

There is a lot of dialogue and effort.

The industry has come to realize its lack of representation of the demographics of the world, but it is still struggling with how to “fix” it. However, there is a lot of dialogue and effort. There are more people of color than ever, but it does seem difficult to grab the “brass ring” and hold onto it. Senior leadership representation is light given how long African-Americans have been participating in the industry, but if we can build a pipeline of talent and prepare them well, I believe we can continue to make progress toward a more balanced representation on all levels and in all disciplines.

JLL Vice President Jordan Yarboro
Brokerage | Boston | Male | 7 YEARS OF EXPERIENCE 

Most firms are actively searching for diverse talent. 

I’ve never experienced any negativity toward race, but maybe apathy. However, I think that attitude is changing as most firms are actively searching for diverse talent. It will take some time, because this industry is accustomed to attracting talent from traditional sources and will need to be more creative and proactive in their approach to the black community, specifically.

Investment Sales Brokerage | Washington, D.C. | Male | 6 YEARS OF EXPERIENCE 

I have not seen a huge change.   

I have not seen a huge change, but I have recently noticed that some service companies are looking to bring in black agents to appeal to the market they service. I have not seen this push in states that do not have a lot of black ownership.

Genesis founder Karim Hutson
Development | New York City | Male | 16 YEARS OF EXPERIENCE 

I think now there are a good number of MBE developers.

When I first started I think there were a scarce number of Minority-owned Business Enterprise developers — that were pretty poorly capitalized — trying to execute development projects. I think now there are a good number of MBE developers, black developers that have capitalization, though maybe not as much as they want, and that have experience. We need to grow those companies. They need to do more deals so they can grab more experiences and they can grab more capacity, to grab more liquidity so they can do more deals and can birth more and more opportunities.

I'm very proud that at least two folks who worked for my staff that are MBE professionals have gone off to start their own firms. I see that as a [point] of pride that we're able to train a new generation of MBEs.

I think people need to understand that you can't categorize black developers or MB developers as all being emerging or not having access to capital or not having all the capacity. They need to evaluate them fairly in the marketplace as they would any other firm, and give them the opportunities they deserve. That's what's changing and we need to continue to change.

JLL Senior Vice President Mark Washington
Investment Sales | Seattle/Portland | Male | 13 YEARS OF EXPERIENCE 

The industry and corporate environment have definitely made strides forward to improve the culture.

The industry and corporate environment have definitely made strides forward to improve the culture — not just racial bias but all forms of diversity, equity and inclusion. With that, there is still much to do. Providing training around the unconscious biases that we exert; creating a place of community for minority categories; investing in actively providing access to resources for minorities to succeed, such as mentorship programs; actively spending time to support initiatives that improve our hiring practices to hopefully shift the demographic makeup of industries such as CRE are all things that can consistently be focused on as we all [strive] to make continued improvements.

Marketing | Atlanta | Female | 20+ YEARS OF EXPERIENCE 

I’d like to see more black brokers.

I’d like to see more black brokers, managing brokers and also female black brokers in the industry. The Atlanta Commercial Board of Realtors has and continues to put some effort toward diversity and that’s a good step in the right direction.

In the role of marketing, I know very few black women who head up marketing for a local Atlanta firm or a regional office in Georgia. That needs to change. A diverse talent pool, aside from building a strong brand for their companies, can bridge language barriers and cultural differences that can often be an obstacle for companies wanting to expand their businesses and market their services to an expanded client base.