Weekend Interview: Kim Ford On Her Rise Up Pittsburgh's CRE Scene And The Podcast Charts

This series goes deep with some of the most compelling figures in commercial real estate: the deal-makers, the game-changers, the city-shapers and the larger-than-life personalities that keep CRE interesting.

It takes an especially driven person to go from answering phones at Trammell Crow Co. fresh out of high school in the early 1990s to launching her own office tenant representation firm in Pittsburgh in 2009. That same entrepreneurial spirit led her during the pandemic to launch her own podcast series, Rise: Evolve Leadership, which has burnished her social media fame among the commercial real estate community.

Recently, the Commercial Real Estate Influencer's organization named Ford among the top women social media personalities in 2023. It's an ironic feat given that Ford said she only began the podcast — which features corporate executives and thought leaders from a variety of industries — to keep up with clients during the weeks of shelter-in-place orders across the country. She's now hosted more than 50 episodes of the show.

"I never imagined that it would take off at all," she said. "It took off to the point that we don't solicit people anymore. We turn away 90% of those who ask to come on."

When not on the air, Ford heads up her own tenant-representation brokerage firm called Rise Pittsburgh, leading a team of six tenant representation brokers. Most recently, Ford's firm helped Castle Biosciences ink a 44K lab space deal at Nova Place and assisted autonomous vehicle maker Aurora's 125K SF headquarters, both in Pittsburgh.

Ford has come a long way since a former employer told her she would be better off never trying her hand at sales, that women did not possess the skills to make a living. That detractor just motivated her to work harder, Ford said. 

"I didn't want to go move to a big shop and just work for somebody. I'm extremely entrepreneurial. And by opening my own shop I could do that," Ford told Bisnow. "I had the freedom to throw a lot of spaghetti at the wall and see what stuck. And back then, as a woman, you didn't get that opportunity: I wanted a voice. I wanted my own voice and I wanted the freedom to be creative."

Now after more than 20 years of running her own brokerage firm, assisting such clients as American Express, Castle Biosciences, Dell, Oracle Corp. and Wells Fargo, Bisnow sat down with Ford to discuss her views on diversity in the industry, the challenges facing the office market today and how the skills she hones being a popular podcaster translates to the negotiation table. 

The following has been edited for length and clarity.

Bisnow: What led you to commercial real estate brokerage as a career?

Ford: I fell into the opportunity. Just out of high school, I worked at a recruiting firm as an assistant, but I watched what the men were doing around me and thought I could easily do the same. I went to my then-boss and asked for the opportunity. He said, 'I actually like you. I don't want to see you fail.' But I would have kicked ass and made him a lot of money. But he wouldn't give me a shot.

So I looked for a job that day. I just looked for another opportunity and at that point in my life I was going to try to look for something that allowed me to do better. I read about a receptionist position at the Trammell Crow Co. and took it.

I soon got my license and landed my own office deals. In my first deal, I made more than what my whole salary was. We hired a new receptionist.

Bisnow: Tell me about the time you realized that you could really make a career at this?

Ford: I remember listening to the managing broker and thinking I could do what he was doing. I had nothing to lose and I was willing to work hard. About a year in the business, I was calling on growing national companies. I ended up pitching a telecommunications company in Baltimore and landed work across the country.

Bisnow: Can you tell me a little bit about Rise Pittsburgh and what sets you apart from other brokerage firms?

Ford: We are a boutique tenant rep firm. We only represent tenants, never landlords and we’ve always stayed in our lane.

We have been building proprietary software, called Ghost Technologies, for a few years. Ghost enables our clients to have a much better experience, as they seek to find their perfect space. We released our financial module in 2022 and plan to release our full version in 2023.

Bisnow: Give us a bold prediction for the rest of the year.

Ford: The commercial real estate industry will face difficulties this year. The majority of business owners struggle to strike a balance between encouraging individuals to come to the office and work from home.

Larger businesses have put off making long-term decisions, therefore we are seeing more businesses that want to sign short-term leases. I predict defaults on office buildings, mostly in central business districts, as well as several brokers quitting the industry due to a lack of work. I actually think [resignations are] going to be at all levels, which is unusual in the market. Even the senior levels don't want to work anymore so they're just going to retire.

Bisnow: Looking ahead over the next few years, how do you think this will ultimately play out and what will that mean for the office industry?

Ford: Businesses are using office space differently. Many positions can be completed from home, while others cannot. Cross-departmental and cross-team collaboration is essential for many growing companies.

It's through quality time spent together that opportunities and breakthroughs are discovered. Companies will provide more collaborative areas in their space and demand amenities from the properties they lease. Landlords must invest in amenity spaces.

Bisnow: Improving diversity in the industry has been a top concern among major brokerage and development firms over the past few years. How is today's diverse makeup of the industry compared to what it was five years ago? What still needs to be improved?

Ford: Although it's wonderful to see some increased diversity in commercial real estate, there is still much to be done. The 60-year-old white man holds a position of authority within the majority of commercial real estate firms, national landlords and corporate enterprises.

When they start retiring, you will see a fresh wave of opportunities. Many people attribute our lack of diversity on the commercial real estate sector, but until institutional owners and corporate leadership adapt to welcome more diversity, we will also have difficulties. It's on the way.

Bisnow: You have been named as CREi's top social media influencer. What role does social media play in today's CRE market? How does it work for you?

Ford: Building a personal brand is critical for anyone looking to break through in commercial real estate. Social media plays a huge role in our industry. It enables you to have a voice that can reach anyone.

For me, I try to create authentic content that provides value. I’m embarrassed when I create videos, but I know others find them valuable. It's really hard to do. It's hard to put yourself out here. And I'm afraid to make a mistake. You have to put yourself out there and that's why a lot of people don't do it, but you have to do it. I’ve had to figure out how to be comfortable with being uncomfortable a lot in this business. Everybody needs to be creating content and to me there's nothing rawer than just you talking.

I think a mistake a lot of people make when they do social media is they sell themselves. The whole bragging of, 'Just do this, just do that. Look at me,' instead of, 'Look at my client. Look at what they're successful at.' I think that's where a lot of people make mistakes.

Bisnow: What is your weekend routine or favorite weekend activity?

Ford: My weekend routine is very consistent with my weekday routine. I wake up early and go to bed early. I built a gym in my home during Covid and enjoy tonal workouts and playing pickleball. For me, playing pickleball is my way to disconnect.

If I play in a competitive group, I can’t think of anything but the game. I also enjoy traveling to watch my teenage daughter play club volleyball and my teenage son compete in professional pickleball.

Bisnow: Giving back to the community is clearly an important endeavor for you. Why is it important, especially in today's world?

Ford: Giving back in any way has always been important to me. I have served in many capacities over the years but the one that stands out the most for me right now is my ongoing relationship with the two women I met through the Foundation of Hope.

I met with both women, every week, while they were incarcerated. It was a long journey but once they were released, we continued our relationship. I believe in second chances. I believe we all make mistakes. In the modern world, we will all face difficulties. When things are tough, everyone wants someone to hold their hand.

Bisnow: How do landlords combat becoming obsolete in the eyes of the tenant market today?

Ford: Amenities, amenities, amenities. Build them unless you like having an empty building.

Bisnow: What will be the hardest obstacles for the industry this year?

Ford: Lack of long-term leases. A lot of businesses right now want to sign a short-term deal because they don't know what the future will hold. Especially in the tech sector, a lot of tech companies can't raise a lot of money right now, so if they have a lease coming up, they just hold still.

Bisnow: What is your most controversial CRE opinion and why are you right about it?

Ford: My most controversial CRE opinion is probably about office building financing. Tenants are leasing space differently and rent rolls are changing. Lender financing needs to adapt to the ways landlords have to lease space or we will see defaults that don’t need to occur.

Bisnow: What would you say is the biggest difference in terms of work ethics and career goals among younger generations today?

Ford: The younger generation desires an Amazon Prime-like experience across the board.

Success does not come overnight. The younger generation likes instant gratification. In many industries, including commercial real estate, grinding and a lot of patience are necessary to establish a portfolio and achieve success.

When I first transitioned from tennis to pickleball it was so easy, and I’d crush the ball. My left-handed drive was a weapon. As I played better opponents, they’d just block my drive and I had to learn to slow the ball down and grind out the point with patience waiting for the opportunity to put it away.

The same goes for commercial real estate. To find success, you have to create a lot of relationships, hit a lot of balls, work hard, practice and have patience. Young people today don't like the word, 'Eventually.' They gravitate to the words 'Right Now.' This will dissuade some people from CRE.

Bisnow: Through your podcast, you regularly interview leaders in the industry. What would you say is the art behind interviewing people who are often at the pinnacle of their careers to get the most candid thoughts from them?

Ford: The art behind being a podcast host is the same as being a good tenant rep. You ask questions, you listen, and you look for an opportunity to make an authentic connection.

For me, each guest is a candid conversation. I don’t just ask questions, I share my own stories that relate to theirs. This helps to establish a safe space, and the relationship quickly.

It really doesn't differ from being across a client at the negotiating table. It's all about listening and understanding. If you can relate to the other party you can do a deal much more effectively.